Last week, a member of the House of
Representatives, Lawal Gumau, appeared on Sunrise,
a current affairs programme on Channels Television.
In the interview, the lawmaker, a member of a
pressure group in the House, Transparency Group,
spoke frankly about how budget padding is done in
the National Assembly.
Saying the corrupt practice had remained a yearly
ritual, the lawmaker broke budget padding down in
a way Nigerians can easily understand.
The interview was transcribed by PREMIUM TIMES’
Ebuka Onyeji
Excerpts…
So, what you are saying essentially is that this
padding has been going on for a while and that it
didn’t start today?
I came to the National Assembly in 2011 and I was
fighting padding since 2012 and every year there
was padding in the National Assembly. Nobody can
tell anybody that there is no padding. Let us start
investigation and everybody who investigate will
know there was padding.
What exactly is padding?
Padding is to insert something into a document with
the intention of comforting yourself or distorting
information. Check any dictionary, that is the
definition. Before we came out yesterday we had to
look at different dictionaries and see the meaning of
padding. Let us be fair to this people.
So they inserted certain things to comfort
themselves?
For example, can you tell me in a situation where
two members are here, one is representing a
constituency in Bauchi then the other is
representing another constituency in Bauchi. Mr. A
is having four billion for his constituency while Mr.
B is having only 70 million. Four billion and
70million. Can you see the frustration of Mr. B? And
Mr. A did not inform the national assembly that he
wants to put four billion in his constituency.
In the statement of the house that was initially
issued when Jibrin made his allegations, they said
they have house tactics, that principal officers
usually get a bigger chunk of the money allocated
for constituency projects to the house or to the
senate and that has been the tradition for a
while.
Thank you so much. Naturally you can’t expect the
general manager of Channels TV to get what you get.
Naturally a leader must get something more than
what the follower will get. But what we are saying is
padding comes after that.
For example, zonal intervention (projects) was
shared between six geo-political zones. Between this
six geo-political zones, every state has its own share.
This one is known to everyone. Where the problem
comes in is that there are some information that
were hidden by the leadership which they did not
divulge to members and this information was used
by them alone. Can’t you people see padding there?
Naturally, a leader must get something more than,
but can you imagine a leader getting four billion and
a follower getting just 40 million. I have a friend in
Anambra State. Up till today, nothing was put in his
account by the speaker. For personal reason, for
selfish reasons because they have differences. Even
yesterday, he came to my office, telling me there is
no kobo in his account. I advised him to go to the
speaker and he said he went to the office of the
speaker 10 times. Even before Jibrin was removed,
he went to his office five times. Yet nothing.
… So it means, correct me if am wrong, the house
does not get to see the final copy before it is sent
to the senate for assent and after it has been sent
to the executive the entire house does not see the
final copy of the budget that people usually say
they have approved. is that what happens?
I pray one day you will be in the house to see these
things clear. Now listen to me. After the budget from
the committees go to the appropriation committee,
they will now work on the budget. After working on
the budget, the committee will return it to members
of the chamber who will now read it and agree on it.
If padding doesn’t come in up to that point then
immediately after the house passes the budget before
they submit it to the president and that is where
padding comes in.
The president will not know that this project was not
in the budget the members approved. The president
will give assent. The members on the other hand
will not know that after passing the budget that
something was inserted. So what we are saying is
that when they bring back the approved (assented)
budget, that is where we the ordinary members will
know something is inserted from what we approved.
When you talk of insertion, are you talking of
new line items inserted or just ordinary figures
increased?
Yes, new line items. Let me give you a clear
example. This Kano film house that was in public
debate, we did not approve it in the budget. It was
inserted before taking it (the budget) to the
president for assent and money was allocated to it.
Go to the constituency of all the leaders, especially
the ones Jibrin accused, you will be surprised that
after zonal intervention given to their
constituencies, they went ahead to insert billions of
naira in their constituencies.
So this is not about the leadership tussle that
preceded the inauguration of the House?
It has nothing to do with it, Maukpe. The house had
let that go and we had agreed, including the leaders,
let there be no padding. Before Ramadan, there was
an executive session, where precisely Hon. Babanle
Bashir raised the issue that we don’t want padding
this year and we will not agree and we will not fight
it internally but externally if need be. They
promised they would not it and that they would sit
down with members after two weeks … that there
will be no padding. Then up till today all this
promises never happened. When we went to Mecca
we came back assuming that after we came back that
we would be called for executive session to decide
but up till when we went on recess, there was no
executive session.
By that time the allegations had not come out?
It has, Maukpe. But it was not yet in the public
domain
So it’s Jibrin that raised this allegations?
You know God knows how to punish a criminal.
What happened was that Jibrin was part of them.
They were hiding these things. It was only Jibrin, as
chairman of appropriation committee that knows
everything that happened. We did not know. We
only knew that most likely they would pad this
budget because since 2011 that I came into the house
every year there was no year they did not pad it.
So you are saying that the allegations Jibrin made
were true?
Mind you, I am not supporting Hon. Jibrin. I am
supporting the allegations and I am not saying that
they are true because I am not a lawyer. What I am
saying is that if Jibrin made allegations against
them, why can’t there be an investigation because
padding is an offence.
Who do you want to do that investigations?
We don’t want a committee within the house to do
that investigation because they are all appointees of
the speaker. We don’t want the senate too because
they are committees by the senate president.
What is the attorney general of the federation
doing? Is he not the law officer? If there is a
petition, can’t he order an investigation? We have
EFCC, ICPC and we have the police. What are they
doing that they can’t investigate this issue. What we
are just saying is let the house open this budget
issue for investigation.
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